Bobby and Alex react to a truly mind blowing final day of the 2024 regular season that saw the New York Mets do extremely non-New York Mets things to make the cut for the postseason. Then, they fill out their postseason bracket based on the Power of the Narrative, defining what the narrative would be if each team won the World Series and determining which is the most preferable. Finally, Alex bids farewell to the A’s and processes the mixed emotions he felt watching the final game at the Oakland Coliseum.
Tipping Pitches features original music from Steve Sladkowski of PUP.
Transcript
Tell us a little bit about what you saw and be able to relay that message to Cora when you watch Kimbrel pitch and kind of help out so he wasn’t tipping his pitches. So tipping pitches we hear about it all the time. People are home on the stand what tipping pitches all about? That’s amazing. That’s remarkable.
BOBBY: Alex, let’s let my friend Gary Cohen do the talking.
GARY: And Lindor gets under one to center field. Harris going back.
KEITH: It’s out.
GARY: back near the wall. And it’s out of here. Linsanity again. Francisco Lindor flips the script with a two-run homer and the Mets go in front 8-7. Oh, wow!
KEITH: Oh, boy.
ALEX: I’m just watching the— the sideline video of him hitting that home run while you’re playing the audio.
BOBBY: You’re getting, like, the panopticon experience.
ALEX: Sideline. Sideline. You know, sideline.
BOBBY: Yeah, sideline, just like in baseball.
ALEX: The thing we have in baseball.
BOBBY: Yeah, yeah. We have the baseline, the sideline, and mid— mid court.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Are you tapping in on basketball this year? Is that— you’re breaking that news live on the pod?
ALEX: Well, I’m following Jeff Passan wherever he goes.
BOBBY: Oh, man, we’re off to a good start here. We are off to a good start. Yo, the Mets.
ALEX: The Mets.
BOBBY: One of the craziest regular season baseball games ever? Ever.
ALEX: Yeah. And barely regular season. Like this doesn’t—
BOBBY: Right.
ALEX: —even qualify as like a regular season game.
BOBBY: We’re in— like, we’re in—
ALEX: This is quite a regular season.
BOBBY: We’re in some never before seen nether region between—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —the regular season and the postseason. I mean, we’ve had game 163s before that are basically of equal importance to this. But the weirdness of this game— and of course, I’m talking about the— the game one of the Mets-Braves doubleheader on Monday as we sit here to record this, but probably, you know, late Monday night or Tuesday, if you’re listening to this right now. The doubleheader that was caused by the hurricane that hit Atlanta right before— or right as the Mets were about to play their pivotal three-game series and their penultimate series of the season before going to Milwaukee to close out the season. So if you’re listening to this, I’m sure you know about that. As we record, the Mets and Braves are in the middle of game two, bottom of the seventh right now. Braves just took a 3-0 lead. They had been leading 1-0, but that’s okay, because the Mets are already in.
ALEX: Good. I’m gonna ask you every few minutes what’s going on in the game, just to really get the listeners in the zone—
BOBBY: I would— I would love—
ALEX: In the zone of the game that happened at this point yesterday.
BOBBY: I would love if the Mets just came back and won this game and eliminated the Braves out of the postseason and sent every single fan—
ALEX: That— that would make the pod.
BOBBY: —in that stadium home depressed, because that would be what they would deserve after the last, I don’t know, forever of what the Braves have done to the Mets, but that’s a different story. We’re not here to talk about that. We’re here to talk about the fact that this is one of the weirdest weeks that you could have possibly concocted if you drew it up in a lab. This is one of the weirdest weeks of fandom for me as a Mets fan, and all of that pales in comparison to the fact that the playoffs are about to start tomorrow. We are going to preview that, and if Alex is feeling up to it, if he has gotten enough emotional distance from this event occurring, we’re going to talk about the A’s playing their last game in the Oakland Coliseum. But before we do all of that, I am Bobby Wagner.
ALEX: I am Alex Bazeley.
BOBBY: And you are listening to Tipping Pitches.
[theme]
BOBBY: Alex, before the— before the madness starts, gotta say thanks to our new patrons this week. What a week they’ve picked to tap in on the Patreon. New patrons this week, we got an Alexander.
ALEX: I need a— I need to drop a message in the group chat and say, “Start spacing out your subscriptions, you know?”
BOBBY: Yeah, it’s starting to look a little bit coordinated.
ALEX: Exactly.
BOBBY: Like the Russian bot farm you’ve hired—
ALEX: Right, exactly.
BOBBY: —to sign up for our patron. You’re just paying out-of-pocket. Corbin, Graham, Eileen, [4:12] and Garrett. Thanks to everybody for signing up for the Patreon. Put out a Patreon episode last week. We’ll be putting out another one, not this coming week, but the week after, and all throughout— all throughout October. We put out a Patreon episode every other week, patreon.com/tippingpitches. I gotta tell you, I feel like I ran a fucking marathon. I feel like— I— maybe I wasn’t excited enough. Like, maybe— did I get excited enough at the beginning of the pod? What do you think?
ALEX: I— well, I think— I think you let the Mets speak for themselves. You got— you certainly got excited enough when I walked into your apartment, you were just standing there—
BOBBY: You want to set the scene?
ALEX: —with the biggest—
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: —grin on your face, with both arms raised in the air. No words.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: No sounds.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: Just pure, unbridled, unfiltered joy. You got me in the mood.
BOBBY: The Mets have made the playoffs just once in our time doing this podcast. In our seven years of doing this podcast, the Mets have appeared in the postseason one time, one time for one series.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Okay? Now, we’re about to go out to our second time. Will they make a pass one series? Yet to be determined, but we’re riding this high right now.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: That’s for damn sure. Easily the nervous— the most nervous most nervous I’ve been for a baseball game since 2015. Not even close. Not even close.
ALEX: Well— and we were sitting here a couple weeks ago, lamenting. I was lamenting, right? Like no drama at the end of— the end of the baseball season anymore. We don’t have the— the drama that comes with tiebreakers or anything like that. Hey, you know what? Tip your cap to Rob Manfred, scheduling—
BOBBY: I was gonna say, let’s start here.
ALEX: —scheduling masterclass, creating the drama that we all needed.
BOBBY: I got a text message from a friend, and that text message said this, “By the way, unfortunately for us, Rob Manfred is an evil genius.” Is that true or is he just failing upwards?
ALEX: I— I think—
BOBBY: Nothing about this was the right decision.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: Nothing about it.
ALEX: No.
BOBBY: But guess what? It worked out. You could basically— that’s basically like the sub-header for the Rob Manfred book.
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: Nothing about this was right, but somehow it worked out.
ALEX: So you’re saying the only rule is it has to work? I think that—
BOBBY: I think that one—
ALEX: No, I think that one’s—
BOBBY: I think that one’s taken. No, I think that one’s taken. Yeah.
ALEX: I think actually the— the—
BOBBY: But that— that book is not about baseball, is it?
ALEX: Hmm, no, it’s consulting—
BOBBY: Oh, it’s actually [6:24]
ALEX: Oh, okay. I— I actually think the— the worst thing that a baseball fan can— can do in these moments is think about, like, Rob Manfred. What is Rob Manfred— like, just— just soak it in, you know? Just let it wash over you. You have years.
BOBBY: Just keep going. Stevie’s gonna bark throughout this whole episode, but we’re not stopping him.
ALEX: Cured— cured [6:42] Manfred and was like, “I gotta get my two cents.”
BOBBY: The Mets have Eddy Alvarez at-bat, playing shortstop today. Okay, we don’t need to stop for Stevie barks. Over eight on the year, 200 OPS.
ALEX: Look, I just— I think we’re doing ourselves a disservice if we’re lending Rob Manfred any— any modicum of—
BOBBY: Oh, you’re a modicum guy now? A modicum guy?
ALEX: This is why I don’t say big words, you know? It’s like— then you say them out loud and you get them wrong.
BOBBY: I think either is right. Maybe that’s just the East Bay accent creeping out.
ALEX: Modicum.
BOBBY: Yeah, no, I don’t want to hear Michael Bowman say that word. As I look down at the— the broadcast of game two here against the— against the Braves, they are preparing the Mets clubhouse for a celebration. I hope that that is non-alcoholic champagne, because they got a baseball game to play tomorrow, folks.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Keep Luis Severino away from that.
ALEX: Got him drinking that Jackson Holliday beer.
BOBBY: They got him drinking tart cherry and spindrift.
ALEX: That’s true. They’re just like you for real.
BOBBY: Exactly. Here’s the real take, no other sport has this. No other sport has even close to this.
ALEX: It’s true.
BOBBY: No other sport has the absolute pandemonium and delirium of a series of events so unlikely, so unbelievable, so statistically improbable, and yet, so narratively satisfying and almost expected. When Lindor hit the homerun in the top of the ninth, set aside the six run inning, which came out of absolutely fucking nowhere, because they look dead as a doornail.
ALEX: Yep.
BOBBY: Door nail or doorknob? Which one? Which one’s more dead? You say what?
ALEX: I— a door nail, probably.
BOBBY: Is there a phrase with doorknob?
ALEX: That is— you know what? I’m gonna— we’re gonna— we’re gonna let—
BOBBY: Cha— ChatGPT is not gonna get it right.
ALEX: —the World Wide Web— I’m gonna type in Dead as a.
BOBBY: You’re going to Grok, right?
ALEX: Yeah, I’m going to grok. The first one is dead as a doornail meaning. The second one is dead as a doorknob meeting. So that wasn’t helpful at all.
BOBBY: Okay.
ALEX: But Google AI says— I think it’s dead as a doornail.
BOBBY: Okay. We took my love—
ALEX: The— the doorknob—
BOBBY: We took my love letter to the beauty of baseball, and we just brought it to a screeching halt to let AI tell us what this phrase is.
ALEX: They were looking dead as— as whatever part of your house, you— it looks the most dead right now.
BOBBY: Dead as the wall.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Dead— dead as the— honestly, the rug looks pretty alive. I like the— I like the rug.
ALEX: I— I went into a meeting—
BOBBY: That is— this couch that we’ve been trying to get rid of for months.
ALEX: I— I went into a meeting that lasted, like, 15 minutes, and I came out and the Mets were leading. I was like, “What?”
BOBBY: Wow. Did you consider staying in that meeting, maybe? Calling everybody back in, “Hey, boys and gals, we got to stay here. My friend’s a Mets fan, and things are going well.” You’re— our friend and your boss, technically, was texting me throughout that whole run.
ALEX: Yes.
BOBBY: So it would have been okay to do.
ALEX: He was Teams messaging to me and I was like, “I’m literally doing work right now.”
BOBBY: Wow, Teams, Teams. So you had the grind set on? You were grinding through the whole thing?
ALEX: I was, yeah.
BOBBY: I— you set aside that extra inning, which, again, came out of nowhere [10:03]
ALEX: Well, well, once you saw a tied ball game come up to the plate, you knew—
BOBBY: Well, the 10 pitch at-bat, or 12 pitch at-bat, or whatever he took, that’s why you sign a guy like that.
ALEX: Yep.
BOBBY: That’s why idiots like me get on podcasts hosted by idiots like us, and we say dumb shit like Tyrone Taylor is not good. David Stearns doesn’t know what he’s doing. He’s playing favorites from his time in Milwaukee. Okay? The reckoning is here, all right? And we’re going to talk more about this later, because I have a lot of thoughts about the narrative surrounding the New York Mets heading into the postseason. The way that we are going to preview the postseason is we are going to narrative ball it, which I think we did last year, but I don’t remember, and I didn’t care enough to look.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: So if we did it last year, it’s the Second Annual—
ALEX: Brought it back.
BOBBY: —Narrative-Ball Postseason Preview from Tipping Pitches. If we didn’t do it last year, just thought of this idea out of thin air.
ALEX: Welcome to the Inaugural—
BOBBY: The Narrative-Ball—
ALEX: —Narrative Bracket— nar— brat, Narrative Brack.
BOBBY: Yeah. October Madness.
ALEX: Hmm.
BOBBY: No one’s ever thought of anything like that.
ALEX: That’s good. That’s good.
BOBBY: They just— you just knew. You just knew they were gonna blow it. They tried to squeeze an ending out of Phil Maton, and guess what? It didn’t work. There’s a reason that the Ray— the Rays cut Phil Maton. There’s a reason that the Astros didn’t bring back Phil Maton. And he’s done great things for the Mets this year.
ALEX: Right. But the Rays and the Astros are cutting the starting pitcher.
BOBBY: I gotta have them. He’s just like, “I gotta have them.” And they brought him out there, and he put a couple runners on, so they went to Edwin. And I don’t even think I realized this, because I was— I had a busy weekend, and I was in transit yesterday while I was following Mets in their final game of the series against Milwaukee, but I was not watching as Edwin pitched two innings. I knew he pitched, I knew he would be coming back on back-to-back days, but I didn’t know that he threw 28 pitches or whatever it was, and two innings in that game. Which, by the way, borderline unforgivable for Carlos Mendoza, knowing he has a doubleheader coming up the next day, and they’re winning 5-0. Crazy. It worked out.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: But you just know, you— you can see it happening in slow motion. It’s like a car crash. Like the Braves are going to do this to them again. This is just like what the Braves did to them in 2022 and 2019 and all throughout the 2000s. This is just like that crazy rain delay Rockies game in 2015, and then it wasn’t. And then it wasn’t. And I’m sitting there and I’m watching the game, and I’m saying to myself, because there’s two people coming up in the top of the ninth before Lindor, “Just let one of them get on base, and I’ll say a prayer to my God and all of your gods listening to this podcast, that Francisco Lindor will be the player that he has been all year, that he will fit so neatly into this beautiful box that we have created for him, this beautiful narrative that we have set for him. He is the player that we have been suffering for, the Mets fans have been suffering for.” And I know people are rolling their eyes listening to this like, “Yeah, Mets fans don’t have it that bad.” You know, like, try being a Pirates fan, which to that, I say, try listening to this podcast for the last few years. I— like, we’ve been giving it to the Pirates, too. And then he did it. It— it felt scripted, and baseball, it goes off the script so often, and it makes all of us look silly for trying to predict the script, that when it does line up with things like that, it truly is magical. It’s— it truly is a almost sublime reminder of why we actually watch this game, why we invest thousands of hours into this game year over year, because stuff like that can happen. And now that might turn into the Mets getting swept by the Padres or Brewers or whatever in the first round, and it might not matter 48 hours from now. But it does matter now, and it did matter to millions of people. And it prompted a Steve Cohen tweet being like, “Wasn’t that fun? Go celebrate.”
ALEX: I didn’t see that.
BOBBY: Yeah. I would like to challenge Steve Cohen, by the way. I’d like to challenge him to open Citi field and put the game on the Jumbotron for the— for the playoff series.
ALEX: For the playoff— for— for the, like, the first series?
BOBBY: Yes. I would like to watch it there with other Mets fans.
ALEX: That’s a great idea.
BOBBY: Thanks. My consulting fee is $1,000 an hour, and Steve can afford it.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: You can make that check out to Bazeley Wagner Productions LLC.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: If you needed our routing info, you can hit up Alex, because I don’t deal with that shit. It scares me. And that’s true, actually.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: That’s not a joke.
ALEX: I know.
[laughter]
ALEX: So here we are, the season is effectively over. We’re— we’re gonna know in five minutes. I don’t know, can we vamp for five minutes, while this game ends?
BOBBY: Oh, I think we should do the AL first, because the NL is still kind of in flux.
ALEX: Okay.
BOBBY: We— we are going to Raisel Iglesias again here, after it didn’t look so hot in the first game. So who knows? Maybe my man, Jose Iglesias, in the Battle of the Iglesiae, will went out again. We— we lost his liner down the right field line to tie the game.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: In all that madness in— in the first game.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Because there was, like, 15 more things that happened interestingly after that, but he rules.
ALEX: Jose Iglesias is just good this year.
BOBBY: One of the best stories of the whole season.
ALEX: So many things.
BOBBY: Just like— just one of the best stories. He’s just a triple A musician. He’s like a 3 WAR player. He is not, though. He’s not a 4 WAR player, which Jazz Chisholm is, and I do need to make amends for that, that I’ll— I’ll— that will be later.
ALEX: I’m so— I’m so glad—
BOBBY: All right. I’ve prepared my [15:20]
ALEX: —that you’ve made amends for that.
BOBBY: —and I have a fork and knife, but we’ll get to that.
ALEX: Anything else you want to get to? Hey— hey, we got an open letter. Jerry Reinsdorf.
BOBBY: No, we didn’t.
ALEX: No? Not no— not an open letter, not qualified?
BOBBY: Somehow, he found a way to make himself look worse than John Fisher this week. Like he just— he did it.
ALEX: Well, I— okay. I— I disagree with that. I think Fisher is still— there’s a special place in hell for him.
BOBBY: Jose Iglesias infield single.
ALEX: Oh, my God.
BOBBY: [15:49] dawg.
ALEX: Well, Reinsdorf is giving him a run for his money, for sure.
BOBBY: He’s trying, yeah.
ALEX: He’s trying. He’s doing his best.
BOBBY: No, he’s trying. He’s making it a game.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: You know, he’s not going down without a fight.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: No, I’m not talking about the fucking White Sox in our postseason preview. I will talk about the A’s, but I’ll leave it up to you as to whether you want to get that out of the way now, or whether you want to save it for the end of the pod. Or whether you want to do a secret third thing.
ALEX: Joke’s on you. I’ve already talked about the A’s. You just didn’t hear it.
BOBBY: Did you go on another podcast or something?
ALEX: I was just in my room.
BOBBY: No, we talked about that.
ALEX: I know, we— we talked about this last week on the Patreon.
BOBBY: Have you ever gone on another podcast without telling me?
ALEX: No.
BOBBY: No?
ALEX: No. I could never.
BOBBY: Okay.
ALEX: I knew you—
BOBBY: Because I— I just want to know.
ALEX: All right.
BOBBY: You know? I’m okay with you doing it, but I just want to know.
ALEX: We’re poly podcasters.
BOBBY: I— I appear on other podcasts all the time.
ALEX: I know, I know you do.
BOBBY: Regularly—
ALEX: Right. It’s one of those ones where—
BOBBY: My regular experience on the Joe Ro— my regular appearance in the Joe Rogan experience.
ALEX: We’ve— we’ve— we have mutually agreed that we’re both allowed to go on other podcasts, but you’re the only one who actually does it. And so it makes me a little bit bitter, I’m not gonna lie.
BOBBY: I mean, when friend of the show, Blake Murphy, comes calling, he’s like, “You have to be on Toronto television.” I’m like, “I guess I do.”
ALEX: And you’re like, “All right.”
[laughter]
BOBBY: All right. That seals it.
ALEX: All right. We can— the game is over. The playoff, fill the set. Let’s— let’s do the bracket first, and then we can do—
BOBBY: I gotta say, it feels bad that they let the Braves in. That feels— we will come back to this. I know it. I know it. I know it. If the Braves win the World Series this year, somehow everyone’s still gonna be mad at the Mets.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Even though this is Rob Manfred’s fault.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: And even though it’s theirs and the Diamondbacks’ fault, really, for shitting the bed down the stretch.
ALEX: That’s [17:39] true. Yeah.
BOBBY: Getting swept like 30-02 by the Giants.
ALEX: Okay. Who among us?
BOBBY: Like everyone, no one got swept by the Giants like that this year.
ALEX: I know, I know.
BOBBY: They just fired their GM. So you want to— do you want to preview the postseason before we talk about the A’s?
ALEX: Let’s— yeah. Well, let’s bring them— I don’t think we want to start that— that segment on a low note.
BOBBY: That feels like the right thing to do journalistically.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: I just wanted to clear it emotionally with you.
ALEX: I appreciate you checking in with me. You’re a great communicator.
BOBBY: You know that—
ALEX: That’s why we’re allowed to go on other people’s podcasts.
BOBBY: You know that— the podcast awards, or like a significant podcast awards body is called the Communicator Awards. How does that make you feel?
ALEX: It just feels like they’re co-opting that word.
BOBBY: Yeah, I don’t know.
ALEX: So I don’t really know the podcast about communication, but anyway, they’re about yelling and— and not being heard, really.
BOBBY: Okay. We— let’s start with the AL.
ALEX: Yeah. You have drafted narratives.
BOBBY: I have drafted narratives, and what I would like you to do is as we go through the bracket, I would like you to choose which narrative you think wins out. Not which team you think is going to win, which narrative you would prefer. And I’ve drafted the narratives with the idea in mind that this will be the narrative coming out of both the fan base, but really, the media, if this team were to win the World Series. This is the predominant narrative that I think would arise. Are you ready, or do you have any questions, processed questions?
ALEX: So this is— this is the narrative that I’m most, like, comfortable with, or is it just like the— the strongest narrative? The narrative that will prevail, so to speak? Or is it just the—
BOBBY: This is the narrative that you—
ALEX: I’m always good—I’m always very good at these, like, abstract segments that you come up and I ask very, like, specific and also very vague questions about it, and then ask you to boil it down.
BOBBY: It’s just— it’s just gut feeling. This is the narrative that you prefer, that you, Alex Bazeley, prefer.
ALEX: Okay. All right.
BOBBY: Don’t try to please everyone at home.
ALEX: Never.
BOBBY: Don’t try to do what Jeff Passan wants you to do. Don’t try to do what Buster Olney wants you to do. Don’t try to do what the listeners at home wants you to do. You do what you want to do.
ALEX: Okay.
BOBBY: Don’t be afraid. Okay, we’re gonna start with the Detroit Tigers versus the Houston Astros. That’s a playoff matchup.
ALEX: That’s—
BOBBY: How did this happen? The Detroit Tigers— actually, let’s start with the Astros. The Houston Astros, the narrative coming out of the 2024 postseason, if the Houston Astros won the World Series, would be, this is truly a dynasty and the bad guys always win.
ALEX: Okay.
bobby: The evil empire had to become an empire.
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: You know? They had to blow up a few planets along the way.
ALEX: Right. Compelling. They had their little dip at the beginning of the year, right after a week.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Everyone was like, “Astros are cooked.” And they were like—
BOBBY: Sike.
ALEX: —”No.”
BOBBY: No. They were treated—
ALEX: “No.”
BOBBY: ——for a little while and then they were like, “Actually, we have a second death start.”
ALEX: So, yes, they are a juggernaut of a baseball team, and— and— and they are the evil empire. They are inevitable.
BOBBY: Versus the Detroit Tigers on a generational run right now, powered by the— the love of baseball and the smooth, dulcet tones of Jason Benetti, the Tiger’s narrative would be, “Miracles are real. A team that didn’t know they were good and actually maybe wasn’t good.”
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: “And then traded away some good players and their rebuild wasn’t working very well.”
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: Actually, played the best baseball since August.
ALEX: Yes. Literally, I think we’re statistically out of the playoff picture like mid-August.
BOBBY: Yeah, 0.8%.
ALEX: Yeah, they got down to 0.2%.
BOBBY: 0.2%?
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Wow, look at you, math check. Okay. Go to put it in a fraction.
ALEX: I don’t even know how that works. It was two divided by— no, that’s—
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: —0.2 divided by 100.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm. Keep going.
ALEX: Isn’t that it? What more do I need to do?
BOBBY: You can’t put a decimal on the top of a fraction.
ALEX: I just did.
BOBBY: Okay. Well—
ALEX: Well, well— all right.
BOBBY: The ba— the bad guys always win versus miracles are real.
ALEX: Hmm.
BOBBY: Which is a juicier narrative to you?
ALEX: I mean— oh, God. I really hate to do this.
BOBBY: Oh. Uh-oh. Uh-oh.
ALEX: But the juicier narrative is the Astros here.
BOBBY: Oh, full heel turn. I love this.
ALEX: Like— like—
BOBBY: Fuck your little miracle. Fuck you, Jason Benetti. Fuck you, the people of Detroit. Alex chooses the Astros. We’ve always been, like, weirdly apologetic to the Astros on this pod.
ALEX: Yes, absolutely.
BOBBY: I don’t know where that comes from.
ALEX: I know. Well, a lot of it, I think there was the reflexive just— you know, we had a sort of reactionary turn after everyone was like, “Fuck the Astros and [22:18]”
BOBBY: Yeah. “Actually, the worst thing that’s ever happened to baseball.”
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: And then we had to be like, “Well, actually, you guys are wrong.” Yeah.
ALEX: Yeah. I just— especially, you have— and I—
BOBBY: I knew this because of Jomboy.
ALEX: Yeah, it actually is.
BOBBY: You know, circle that square, square that circle?
ALEX: To be clear, this is the narrative—
BOBBY: I’m having a tough time of saying on this one.
ALEX: This— this is the narrative if they win the entire World Series.
BOBBY: Correct, yeah.
ALEX: Right? Yes.
BOBBY: Not just if they win the se— you think I put together a narrative for every possible permutation of every series?
ALEX: I wouldn’t— I wouldn’t— I wouldn’t put a— you’ve done crazier things.
BOBBY: [22:49] yeah. But I’ve cut down on caffeine. Those are kind of the— the— that would be, like, the type of thing that I would do on milligrams, 1,000 to 1,200 of caffeine.
ALEX: Right. I mean—
BOBBY: This is more like milligrams like 180 to 250.
ALEX: I mean, I could talk myself out of it, right? The interesting narrative, so to speak, is H. J. Hinch back in the playoffs with the Astros. Not on the Astros, right?
BOBBY: Sure.
ALEX: He will be on the other side of the— the field. And so I do think, like, if you’re looking for a juicy narrative from the Tigers’ perspective, right, it’s like—
BOBBY: Yeah. So, like, H. J. Hinch was the guy powering the whole thing all along.
ALEX: Right, right. Exactly. H. J. Hinch is inevitable, actually. I just—
BOBBY: I’m more of a Joe Espada type.
ALEX: I know you are. I just— the— and again, I know we’re not supposed to be talking about real baseball. This is purely like—
BOBBY: No, no, no. Please feel free to incorporate as much real baseball as possible. This should be a holistic preview. This is just a fun little bit that we’re doing.
ALEX: I just like— I struggle to believe in the Tigers.
BOBBY: But what about Tarik Skubal?
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: Is it Tariq or Tariq?
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Okay.
ALEX: It’s Skubal— it’s Skubal to you.
BOBBY: Mr. Skubal.
ALEX: I don’t know. They just— they just don’t have a lot behind, like, him. They have Riley Green, good player.
BOBBY: We’re doing name some Tigers.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. We’re doing some names. I mean—
BOBBY: Matt Vierling.
ALEX: That— that’s—
BOBBY: That’s the next guy you think of?
ALEX: Uh-hmm. That’s the next guy. I don’t know. I feel like Astro—
BOBBY: I had Matt Vierling on the mind, you know why? Because he took all of the sauce that the Phillies had and he brought it to Detroit. All of the fun, cool vibes.
ALEX: It’s—
BOBBY: It’s left Philadelphia. Now, it’s time to get serious in Philly, and for Detroit, it’s like, “No, we’re still on page one of this book.”
ALEX: Right. I feel like we’re— we’re a little early on the, like, magical season of the Tigers. It would feel a little more like—
BOBBY: Random. It would just be random.
ALEX: —really— it would be kind of like— I think the narrative would ultimately get—
BOBBY: I wouldn’t know what lesson to take.
ALEX: —is MLB playoffs are bad, right? This is why— how are we letting teams like this into the playoffs, let alone, you know, allowing them to make it through? Someone should have stepped in and stopped this, you know?
BOBBY: Wow.
ALEX: Kept it going so far.
BOBBY: So you’re challenging my narrative. You’re saying that my narrative should not— should not have been “Miracles can happen,” but instead, should have been, “The playoffs are a crapshoot and bad.”
ALEX: Look, it’s gonna be— it’s gonna take us about half of this segment for me to even understand, really, what I’m ranking anyway, so— look, I’m going Astros, baby.
BOBBY: I just received a text message from my mom that says, “Milwaukee, it is.” She also sent me a text message earlier that said, “I need a Xanax to watch this game.” So if you’re wondering where I get it from— okay. Next matchup. We don’t have time for this. We have to do the whole postseason.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: So we have to do the other rounds as well.
ALEX: Yeah. Wait, what do you mean?
BOBBY: Like, I want to see who wins the Narrative World Series, so we got to go through all of the different rounds. So when— now you’ve chosen the Astros to advance, so in the second round, they will play the team that had to buy the Cleveland Guardians. We haven’t even gotten to that yet.
ALEX: Oh, okay. Okay. So— so these are— these are holistic narratives for the playoffs—
BOBBY: Correct.
ALEX: —in total, yes, but going up against each other—
BOBBY: Yes.
ALEX: —in each [26:03]
BOBBY: Uh-huh.
ALEX: So next—
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: —me— okay. Uh-huh.
BOBBY: So now the Astros are not, like, playing them on the field, they’re playing them in the narrative— the arena of the narra—
ALEX: Right. Yep, okay.
BOBBY: —the arena of the narrative.
ALEX: All right.
BOBBY: I can’t even talk. I’m not even gonna cut any of this stuff out.
ALEX: We’re doing great.
BOBBY: Okay. Our— our next matchup, the Kansas City Royals are taking on the Baltimore Orioles. Okay. Kansas City Royals. The narrative, I think, of the Kansas City Royals won the World Series would be Bobby Witt, Jr. is the prince who was promised and you don’t actually have to tank. Ruminate on that.
ALEX: Okay. That’s— I mean, he is like the [26:36]
BOBBY: Marinade on it as well. Now, if the Orioles won, I think the narrative would be nearly the exact opposite. Tanking works, and David Rubenstein shifted the vibes.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: So in a battle of those two poles, which side do you lean?
ALEX: I mean, I’m pulling so heavily for the Royals here.
BOBBY: Oh, okay. Great.
ALEX: I— hey, Orioles are fun— in— in terms of this narrative winning out, no. I’m not even gonna— I’m not even gonna justify myself.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: No. In terms of the narratives that I would like to prevail—
BOBBY: Orioles are cooked, sorry, Baltimore fans.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Ravens are bad. Orioles are cooked
ALEX: Sorry, you heard it here first, it’s over. Jackson Holliday on the block.
BOBBY: What would you get for him?
ALEX: I—
BOBBY: Another failed prospect?
ALEX: Wow.
BOBBY: I’ve just been waiting for the Orioles—
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: —shit to not work.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: You know I have.
ALEX: I know you have. Well, and that’s kind of where my head is at, too. You have— you have effectively rubbed off on me with this—
BOBBY: That would never happen on this—
ALEX: —with this sentiment.
BOBBY: —podcast.
ALEX: No.
BOBBY: Group think.
ALEX: No. Never.
BOBBY: No.
ALEX: No hive—
BOBBY: [27:38] spirits—
ALEX: —no hive mind here.
BOBBY: —like us. Two strong-headed libertarians that we are.
ALEX: I think I would— there are very few negative narratives, I think, that would come out of the Royals winning here.
BOBBY: I can think of one.
ALEX: What?
BOBBY: They just won. They don’t need it again. Let someone else have some fun. I— I— another sub-narrative, I don’t think this would be the primary narrative, because, again, Bobby Witt, Jr. is so good and so young, and has such a long, storied career ahead of him, if all things go right, that I think another sub-narrative that would be really cool if the Royals won would be, okay, Sal Per— Sal Perez was here at the beginning of this.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: He stuck it out.
ALEX: Yup.
BOBBY: He was good the whole time. And now Sal Perez is here as like a true, true veteran in a totally different era. And it would be so cool to be able to bridge 10 years of time through Sal Perez getting two different World Series rings. And again, I mean, I have nothing against the Royals fan base, or even anybody who’s left on the Royals. Like I did hate that shit heal villain team that went to back-to-back World Series and—
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: —beat the Mets, but that’s more of a personal problem. I think that they are— they were fun characters in the narrative and history of baseball. And so I gotta say, I think I agree with you. I think this is the right choice. Do you want to say more about the Orioles? Who finished in second in your fraudulent sham—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —of a two-part four-hour podcast, choosing what team that you would be a fan of.
ALEX: I— it’s really funny, because now, whenever something happens to the Mets, the Phillies, or the A’s, someone texts me.
BOBBY: Be like, “Yo, your team is really shitting the bed.”
ALEX: I’m like, “Which one?”
BOBBY: You’re like, “Which one?” Yeah, exactly. That’s how I feel about directors. They’d be like, “Yo, what’s your guy doing?” And I’m like, “Which guy?”
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: Like, “The young one, the middle-aged one, or the old one?”
ALEX: Hey, man, the Or—
BOBBY: Or the dead one?
ALEX: Right. Yeah, exactly. Or the canceled one.
BOBBY: That doesn’t really narrow it down. That’s on Megalopolis?
ALEX: Or— I haven’t— haven’t seen it. Orioles are—
BOBBY: Oh, dude.
ALEX: What?
BOBBY: Pete Rose just died.
ALEX: Oh, my God.
BOBBY: Probably better if we save our words for that for a different podcast.
ALEX: I know, we’ve already had too much celebration in one day.
BOBBY: Hmm. Hmm, hmm, hmm, the Orioles, wow— just gonna need a second.
[laughter]
BOBBY: Maybe if we just keep podcasting long enough, like the whole world will collapse and then rebuild itself—
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: —in the course of this episode.
ALEX: Right. Pete Rose will be alive by the time we’re done with this. I sure hope not. Hey, man, the— the— the Orioles are good, too.
BOBBY: I mean, they could definitely win the World Series.
ALEX: I mean, are— if we’re talking statistical baseball things? Yeah.
BOBBY: They got the four seed, just, like, healthily, did not win the division.
ALEX: No.
BOBBY: I mean, it’s the top Wild Card spot, so they’re basically in the same position as the Padres, who are, like, one of the best teams in baseball on the other side of the bracket.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: But still, they kind of squeaked their way there.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. I think you’d hear a lot of, like, adversity there. This is a team that had to grow up really fast, you know?
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Because, I mean, they were hit with a ton—
BOBBY: It’s so funny. I could literally hear someone saying that on the SportsCenter.
ALEX: I know. I mean, there’s a team that got hit with a ton of injuries this year, right? And as a result—
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: —like, they don’t really have much in the way of a rotation.
BOBBY: It’s crazy what happens when you don’t add depth because—
ALEX: Uh-huh.
BOBBY: —you don’t want to spend money.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: That’s crazy how that works.
ALEX: It is crazy. So anyway, that’s why the Royals won.
BOBBY: I— I gotta say, they feel really 2023 Texas Rangers-y to me. I mean, another Rangers ended up winning their division.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: So they weren’t in quite the same position that the Royals are in now—the Orioles are in now, rather. Excuse me. But incredibly hot start, loaded lineup, mashing the ball, injuries, regression, just a deep, deep funk that the team fell into, kind of crawling towards the playoffs. Boom. October starts, total reset.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Tear through the playoffs.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Could definitely see it happening in terms of real baseball.
ALEX: But that’s not what we’re here to talk about. It never is, Bobby. So the Royals—
BOBBY: Congratulations on advancing—
ALEX: —congratulations, advanced past the Orioles.
BOBBY: —2024 Narrative Postseason. Would you like to finish out the AL or would you like to go over to the Wild Card round in the NL now? What do you think will be less confusing for the listeners? We should do the opposite. We should confuse them as much as possible.
ALEX: We can— can we just do the AL, please? Because I’m already confused.
BOBBY: Okay. Okay, fine. Okay, you now have, somehow, the Houston Astros against the Cleveland Guardians. So you know the Astros narrative, you’ve already talked about this. The bad guys always win. The Cleveland Guardians narrative, I would like to present to you right now, that narrative is Jose Ramirez is finally getting the spotlight he deserves on a national stage. Baseball’s most underrated player for the last 10 years running—
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: —is finally getting the appreciation and he’s deserved all along. First-ballot Hall of Famer, one of the best players of his era, preternaturally consistent, fun, interesting guy, Jose Ramirez. I do think he would be the shining narrative coming out of this, because, quite frankly, no one else knows who the fuck is on this fucking team.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. Yep.
BOBBY: Excuse my language, but that’s just a bunch of guys.
ALEX: Not a— not a big Tanner Bibee guy?
BOBBY: Did he help your fantasy team this year? Yeah, you definitely— look, I can tell, I can tell when you pull out names. I can tell that you picked that guy up on the Waiver Wire. I just know it. I can sniff that out from a mile away. Those are your two narratives, Astros versus Guardians. You say what, Mr. Bazeley?
ALEX: I— I am not immune to a Jose Ramirez—
BOBBY: Hmm.
ALEX: —narrative, I will say.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: It’s a bit of a weak spot for me.
BOBBY: Yeah, he’s one of your guys.
ALEX: You want to talk about guys help my fantasy team.
BOBBY: No one cares about your fantasy team, except like seven random truckers who do long haul driving across this great country and keep the wheels turning.
ALEX: No, I have long professed my love for him on the— on this here podcast. It— it feels like a team, like a gritty team.
BOBBY: Hmm.
ALEX: You know? These are guys who— these are—
BOBBY: Midwestern values.
ALEX: Yeah, that’s right. These are ballplayers, you know?
BOBBY: Yeah. Uh-hmm.
ALEX: These are guys who know how to swing the bat, who put their shoes on one shoe at a time.
BOBBY: Yep.
ALEX: And— and you know what they do? Is they go out there and they play all nine innings.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: Led by their fearless leader, Jose Ramirez, and a bunch of other guys are probably there as well.
BOBBY: I mean, I think if we’re gonna talk sub-narratives here, I do think that the Cleveland School of Player Development, that being scraped together enough hitting, cross your fingers on that front.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: But really put your guys in the pitching lab, continue to develop. You know, I think in the last couple years, it was starting pitching. It’s taken a step back a little bit this year. They haven’t just pulled, like, three Cy Young worthy starters out of nowhere this year. It’s been more of a committee that has gotten them through it and the bullpen remaining strong. Obviously, Emmanuel Clase, best reliever in the game. That would be a prominent narrative in— in October. You would have to think, if they were going to win the World Series. So there are sort of those sub-narratives, but I do think that Jose Ramirez could have— I mean, and he is a much better player than the guy that I’m about to talk about, but Jose Ramirez could have a— a Kung Fu Panda level of pandemonium throughout this October if he were to hit 4.25 with seven home runs and a bunch of clutch spots as the Guardians scrape their way to the World Series.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: And of course, like there’s a curse breaking narrative with this team too. They are the long— they have the longest running drought of any team that is not an expansion team, since the Cubs and the Royals won it. So, you know, there’s a lot going on.
ALEX: Yeah. There’s a lot going on, Bob. And so you know what?
BOBBY: The Cleveland Guardians are going to advance?
ALEX: Cleveland Guardians advance.
BOBBY: Wow.
ALEX: They—
BOBBY: Sayonara to the Houston Astros.
ALEX: —prevail.
BOBBY: Nice work eliminating the Tigers. We go to the bottom of the AL bracket and the ALDS. We see a matchup between the New York Yankees and the Kansas City Royals, who you chose to advance. Now, you know the Royals, Bobby Witt. Jr is the prince who was promised, and you don’t have to tank.
ALEX: I like how— so thus far, I’m just picking the worst team out of the two matchups?
BOBBY: We know how that works.
ALEX: We’ll see how it goes.
BOBBY: Such a fan of the underdog.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: God. Always supporting the little guy, you know? Main Street over Wall Street. Let’s take back this country. The Yankees narrative, aside from the 28 rings, bro, I do think it would be that Aaron Judge is an all-time great.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: We would crown him as one of baseball’s greatest players, which is gnarly because he’s only been in the league for, like, seven years.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Because this is his eighth season since he signed before last year, and hit free agency after six. Yeah, this is eighth season.
ALEX: Good work there.
BOBBY: And Juan Soto was the thing that the Yankees needed to push him over the top. Because if the Yankees win— like, really, the rest of the team is bad.
ALEX: Yes. Yes [37:10]
BOBBY: It’s actually kind of crazy. Like, the rest of the team is straight up not good at all. I mean, Stanton is obviously a great power hitter. There are some other bright spots. You know, the pitching is wildly inconsistent, but like—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —when it’s good, it’s really good. And the young phenom in Volpe came up, struggled, bounced back. Like, they have really, really high hopes for him still, and the fan base does, too. They’ve been, I mean, really going through it this year with Alex Verdugo versus Jasson Dominguez, but, like, that’s a problem that you have— that you have a lot of angst over, because the rest of the team is not good enough to overcome those creeping questions that are in your mind heading into the postseason. Like, if you’re really truly losing sleep over Jasson Dominguez versus Alex Verdugo, I mean, I— and I— I sympathize with it, because Jasson Dominguez is clearly much better than Alex Verdugo, and what they are doing is bizarre. However, like maybe we should talk about the other six spots, if that’s what you’re worried about. So I think that particularly when you put it through the frame of what will the national media say about this? What will be the predominant narrative coming out of October? It will be that Aaron Judge is one of the greatest Yankees ever. We’re putting him in the rarefied air of, you know, Yogi and DiMaggio. I don’t know why I started with Yogi. That’s just one of my guys.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: You know, DiMaggio, Mantle, Yogi Berra, but then also, like Jeter and Posada and—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —you know, all of these guys who— notice how I left that Alex Rodriguez, because he’s not— he’s not in that class of Yankees fans, frankly.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: I think he is basically already there, but you know how they are about rings.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: And you know how if you wear the pinstripes, you gotta just— every year, you don’t win it is a failure, you know?
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Well, then he’s going on any failures.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Sorry.
ALEX: [39:02]
BOBBY: And then Juan Soto, like, being there for one year, I think that probably if they won the World Series, he would come back. Hard to say, but that would be my guess. And I think that that would fit neatly in. I say, like, “Okay, this guy came aboard, won the World Series.” He was the thing that pushed them over the top. Aaron Judge was the thing that built their foundation. These two guys in tandem. You don’t usually see something like this in baseball. This is usually reserved for basketball, like a duo of stars pushing you over the top like this. And obviously, if they’re gonna win, Gerrit Cole is gonna be good too, but that’s the narrative I’ve got for you. So between those two, you choose what—
ALEX: I don’t even remember who they’re playing right now.
BOBBY: The Royals.
ALEX: The Royals, right, yes.
BOBBY: Tread lightly. Fly over, Alex. His reputation precedes him, ladies and gentlemen.
ALEX: Judge and Soto in the playoffs is kind of— kind of too juicy to resist, honestly.
BOBBY: Yeah, you’re such a Yankees apologists.
ALEX: I’m such as Yankees—
BOBBY: I don’t— I don’t know what—
ALEX: Well, you conspicuously left out a name there, when you were talking about the Yankees offense, Bobby.
BOBBY: Ron Marinaccio.
ALEX: Yeah. Yes. The Yankees offense.
BOBBY: The best offense is a good defense, brother. That’s—
ALEX: They got a guy named Jazz Chisholm.
BOBBY: That was cognitive dissonance.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: At its finest.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: Okay, everyone. All right, here we go. Let me set down my coffee for this.
ALEX: Are you pulling out your wallet to give me the $1,000 you promised me live on air on this podcast?
BOBBY: Did I do that?
ALEX: I feel fairly confident.
BOBBY: Find me the audio.
ALEX: Just take it out of our joint bank account.
BOBBY: Yeah. Thanks to everybody for the tweets, the DMs, the emails, the fist waves in the air at the clouds. Thank you to everybody for allowing me— for letting me know that Jazz Chisholm reached 4.0 FanGraphs WAR this baseball season. I would like to submit a formal apology to all of you, the Jazz Chisholm supporters, to fans of the New York Yankees, to fans of the Miami Marlins, to Derek Jeter who believed in jazz Chisholm all along and definitely—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —didn’t do weird shit based on his personality in the clubhouse and leak shit to the media.
ALEX: No.
BOBBY: That definitely didn’t happen. But more than anything— well, I’d like to apologize to the entire Bahamas, I’ve done you wrong.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: More than anything, I would like to apologize to Jazz Chisholm, the man himself, more than a year after being put on the cover of MLB The Show, he has finally had one season that—
ALEX: [41:38]
BOBBY: —is kind of worthy of being on the cover of MLB The Show.
ALEX: I knew we were going to get here eventually.
BOBBY: He’s like the eighth best rising second baseman in baseball under the age of 30. Congratulations to him. But I was wrong, I was wrong. I said he would not have a season like that, not because he’s not talented enough, because he’s never healthy.
And for weird stretches—
ALEX: It seemed like maybe a mixture of both.
BOBBY: Well, you either have to be so unbelievably talented to overcome the fact that you play a 100 games a season, like, say, maybe Aaron Judge was for a few years there.
ALEX: Right, for Jazz Chisholm.
BOBBY: Where he was having, like, six WAR seasons playing 90 games. Like—
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: —whoa, if this guy ever puts it together, and look what happened. He’s good. Obviously, he’s good. He’s good. He’s their third best player.
ALEX: Look, Bob, there’s not a lot I can hang a banner about right now. I— Jazz Chisholm 4 WAR season is about as good as it gets for me.
BOBBY: Fly the flag, dude. Fly that flag. He’s— he’s— he’s good and fun.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: And he has done my favorite things ever, which has exposed hypocrisy within the Yankees fan base. So, you know, I tip my cap to him. He’s no Jose Iglesias.
ALEX: No. You’re right.
BOBBY: That’s for sure.
ALEX: You’re right. But—but all of that—
BOBBY: He probably actually could put out a song that is as good as Oh, my God.
ALEX: I believe it.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. All of that to say, I think Yankees prevail here.
BOBBY: Yeah, of course, they do.
ALEX: Yeah. Of course, they do.
BOBBY: I blame your mom. It’s not her fault.
ALEX: Right. But she planted those seeds earlier.
BOBBY: She did, yeah.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: You— you could have done better. Okay. In the ALCS, we have a titanic matchup between the Cleveland Guardians and the New York Yankees.
ALEX: Oh, God. Seriously—
BOBBY: Your man— your man versus your other men, I guess. Jose Ramirez versus Aaron Judge and Juan Soto.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Which narrative wins out and advances to the World Series?
ALEX: Hmm, hmm. This is a real tough-y. I won’t lie. Which narrative pleases me more? Jose Ramirez getting his— his— his due on a national stage. As you mentioned, probably the most talked about underrated player of all time. Year in year out, it’s like, “Jose Ramirez, pretty underrated.” It’s like, “All right. Well, he had 30 home runs last year. Like, people kind of know he is.”
BOBBY: He ended up going— he did end up going 40-40 this year. He got close.
ALEX: I don’t think he did. He came just shy.
BOBBY: It would have been actually incredible if he went 40-40 and just no one talked about it.
ALEX: I know. So that pleases me more.
BOBBY: Okay, great.
ALEX: Absolutely.
BOBBY: And that’s the answer.
ALEX: Okay, sure. Guard—
BOBBY: Just stand behind your decision, bro.
ALEX: The Guard— well, because I’m— it’s gonna be like, “Well, Guardians-Brewers, World Series. Let’s go.” And the listeners are gonna be like, “I wasted an hour my life on this.”
BOBBY: Do you think the listeners come here to be like, “I hope they choose the big market teams.”? What podcast do you think we’ve been making for the last seven years?
ALEX: Cleveland Guardians, book it.
BOBBY: Okay, great. Book your fucking flights, everybody. We move on to the National League side of the bracket.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Where we have the vaunted New York Mets versus the Milwaukee Brewers and the Stearns bowl. The narratives coming out of these two teams winning the World Series. If the New York Mets win the World Series this year, first of all, the narrative is that Tipping Pitches is going to be off the fucking runner.
ALEX: Yeah. I know. Yeah.
BOBBY: I— I have to say, I honestly think the narrative would be David Stearns as the new curse breaker. I really legitimately think he’d be like, “This is Theo Epstein 2.0,” and they just needed his good luck, I guess.
ALEX: I guess.
BOBBY: But also, combined with the fact that, as relevant maybe, is what I said earlier, that Francisco Lindor is the player that Mets fans have suffered for. And this is truly like we’re reaching greatest Met ever territory, because he’s going to be here for another 10 years.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: If he wins a World Series in year four, and then has another seven years to go—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: — I— I do think that based on just pure longevity delivering, like he’s signed up to be here longer than any of the other guys who ever brought a World Series to the Mets. So it’s kind of those twin narratives. I couldn’t really decide between those two. So whichever one you think would emerge stronger for the New York Mets, a baseball team that has fans.
ALEX: I hear it.
BOBBY: Of which I’m—
ALEX: I’m a member.
BOBBY: I’m one—
ALEX: That’s— yeah.
BOBBY: I’m part of the club. Here’s the narrative if the Brewers win, Moneyball is alive and well, and lives on in the Midwest of this great country. Wisconsin, there’s a lot going on there. Brewers winning the World Series straight into the election.
ALEX: Hmm.
BOBBY: Not happening.
ALEX: Wow. Hmm.
BOBBY: But iron’s in the fire.
ALEX: That’s what I call synergy.
BOBBY: I think of the Brewers as, like, we’re just chasing value, you know? We traded the guy who is lit— who’s our best pitcher and is now the best pitcher on a team that had high hopes for the World Series and was a World Series favorite before the season started, we just traded him. We’re like, “We don’t need him anymore, and we’re just as good, if not better.” Now they’ve patched together a lot of stuff from their bullpen, but isn’t that just Moneyball, you know? Like, don’t they take what other team—
ALEX: Yeah. No, their bullpen’s good.
BOBBY: Yeah. They take what other teams don’t really want or can’t see the value in, and they’re like, “Now, we have a franchise shortstop, you know? Now, we’ve created another starting pitcher who is going to have a 3 ERA season over 180 innings. Now we’ve signed Rhys Hoskins to ruin my fucking life.”
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: And he’s gonna hit 2.10, except he’s gonna hit a grand slam off the Mets when it’s important. We don’t need Corbin Burnes. We need Corbin Burnes in the aggregate.
ALEX: There you go. That’s it.
BOBBY: We don’t need to mention that Jackson Chourio is just Nick Swisher 2.0.
ALEX: Well, that’s— that’s Moneyball, right?
BOBBY: Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. He’s not really Nick Swisher 2.0.
ALEX: No. But he’s pretty darn good. It’s— it turns out your outfield is really good if you just played three centerfielders.
BOBBY: Again, winning on the margins. Really interesting team, cool team. A lot of weird storylines cropping up out of this team, new manager, new GM.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: And it’s just like, “Business as usual.” Oh, you thought the Cardinals were going to win in the NL Central? You dumbass.
ALEX: Yeah. Freddy Peralta is, like, good, if not, great. And yet, here we are, right? It’s like, there— I feel like there are a lot of teams that’ll— have cobbled together—
BOBBY: Yeah,
ALEX: —rotations in particular.
BOBBY: We don’t need Josh Hader anymore. And in two years, they’re gonna be like, “We don’t need Devin Williams anymore.”
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: When the guys get expensive, they’re just like, “We recreate them in the aggregate.” They—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: To me, they are more than the Rays. They are Moneyball 2.0.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: The rays are something different. There’s a more evil, sinister thing.
ALEX: Yeah. Unfortunately—
BOBBY: You can do it. It’s okay.
ALEX: No. I— I don’t think Moneyball 2 is strong enough.
BOBBY: Oh. Curse breaker, David Stearns and Francisco Lindor—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —advancing.
ALEX: I— I think— that narrative, I think, is more compelling to me in part, because it gives us much more fodder to talk about on this here podcast.
BOBBY: We’re setting ourselves up for it.
ALEX: Boy, you liked the Jazz Chisholm mea— mea culpa. Oh, strap in. We’re getting David on live.
BOBBY: Do you think David Stearns would come on this pod?
ALEX: I do. Absolutely.
BOBBY: Like, “David, lifelong Mets fan here. I’ve suffered.”
ALEX: I think he would.
BOBBY: Okay, great. He’s pretty good with the media.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: He’s checked every single fucking box this year. Goddammit. We’re setting ourselves up for a bloodbath in the NLDS, by the way, but we’ll get to that later.
ALEX: It’s fine.
BOBBY: Wild Card matchup number two, Atlanta Braves versus the San Diego Padres. Should the Atlanta Braves win the World Series? The narrative out of that will be God is not real.
ALEX: Right. Racism works.
BOBBY: I wasn’t going there, but— the reason I say God is not real is not just because I’m a Mets fan and not just because Atlanta has one of the most, like, cursed and weird energies of any sports franchise in American history, even though all of that stuff is true. It’s just— they’ve already won it, you know? They already won it with, like, a beat up, battered team with— where a lot of guys, like, stepped up, where you didn’t expect them to, and a lot of their best players were out. You know, Atlanta has cobbled together— cobbled it together all year, with so much of their lineup being injured, losing Spencer Strider, who’s their ace, and just dude stepping up. Schwellenbach has been amazing. He nearly knocked the Mets out of the playoff singlehandedly. But it’s just like, they don’t need another one.
ALEX: Yeah,
BOBBY: They’ve built their own death star, much like Houston has, with incredibly savvy moves and extending young, super talented players. And if they win it in this year when, like, they’re not even firing on all cylinders by any measure, it’s just like God’s not real. Why— what are the— why— why are the rest of us playing?
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: I think that that will be the narrative coming out of that.
ALEX: They squeeze 180 Cy Young innings out of Chris Sale.
BOBBY: I know.
ALEX: That— that one. No, I’m talking about the same Chris Sale.
BOBBY: I know. I know. And I don’t even— like, I’m not even saying that in a slight. I’m saying that in like a— there is no justice. There’s no moral, traditionally religious justice in this world, mis— whether it’s your god or the baseball gods, or whatever you want to think of it’s just like there’s no— it’s not right. It just—
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: —doesn’t feel right.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: It wouldn’t feel right to any fan base, except Atlanta.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Versus the San Diego Padres, whose narrative will be A. J. Peller was right all along. Alex, as Dashboard Confessional once said, “I am vindicated. I am selfish. I am right. I swear I’m right. I swear I knew it all along. I’m flawed—”
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: “—but I’m cleaning up so well.”
ALEX: Well done.
BOBBY: Thank you.
ALEX: Well done.
BOBBY: Also, you know, and win it for Peter Seidler, the late great.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: One of the most beloved owners in baseball—
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: —in the last two decades. Who wins that narrative matchup?
ALEX: This feels like Padres in a landslide.
BOBBY: Last year, when we previewed the season—
ALEX: Not even close.
BOBBY: Last year, when we previewed the postseason, we left the Braves out of it. Like straight up, we just didn’t talk about them.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: Still one of our funnier bits. All right, moving on.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Unless you have more to say about the Padres. You’ll have a chance to talk about them when they— when they match up with the Dodgers.
ALEX: That’s true. Okay. Yeah.
BOBBY: But before that, not to be outdone, we have the New York Mets, Stearns and Lindor, versus your Philadelphia Phillies.
ALEX: Ouch.
BOBBY: I have two narratives here for you.
ALEX: All right.
BOBBY: Number one is more of a cultural narrative and number two is more of a baseball narrative. Which would you like to hear first?
ALEX: Give me the cultural one.
BOBBY: Okay. Philadelphia is still the center of the universe.
ALEX: Yep.
BOBBY: If the Phillies—
ALEX: Philly supremacy, easy, easy.
BOBBY: —wins the World Series, fucking Josh Shapiro at the parade.
ALEX: Yep.
BOBBY: You know, Kamala wins the election a week later, she’s coming through.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Drinking beers with Schwarber, reaching across the aisle.
ALEX: John Fetterman is out there, too.
BOBBY: Yeah. Okay, all right.
ALEX: Right. Well—
BOBBY: Well, that’s not fun. It was still fun with Shapiro somehow. Maybe Dr. Oz will be there.
ALEX: What’s your— what’s your—
BOBBY: I think Dr. Oz is running in New Jersey now.
ALEX: No way.
BOBBY: I don’t know. I saw some signs on my bike ride.
ALEX: In Adam’s home state?
[laughter]
BOBBY: Yo, so much stuff has happened since Eric Adams was indicted while we were doing the Patreon episode. The baseball narrative, I think, is spending money is good.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: Yeah. If you can sign Bryce Harper, do sign Bryce Harper.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Yeah. I think it’s— but more succinctly, I think it’s do the obvious thing.
ALEX: Right. Don’t overthink shit.
BOBBY: Yeah, exactly.
ALEX: Don’t get cute. Just play baseball. Just put together a baseball team full of guys.
BOBBY: So Mets versus Phillies, Lindor is who we suffered for and Stearns is the curse breaker, versus Philadelphia as the center of the universe and do the obvious thing. Just Titanic matchup.
ALEX: Titanic matchup. And— and regrettably, Bobby—
BOBBY: I know.
ALEX: —it’s Phillies here.
BOBBY: I agree.
ALEX: Huge narrative, Philly supremacy narrative weighs so strong that does not even get into the actual baseball element of it.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Which is that the Phillies are a good baseball team, and the Mets—
BOBBY: Tread lightly.
ALEX: —are here. They’re also a baseball team that is also a roster of 26 guys.
BOBBY: When Tylor Megill beats Zack Wheeler in game five of the NLDS, I will—
ALEX: [54:09]
BOBBY: —I will get in my car, and I will drive down to Broad Street in Philadelphia, and I will run down the center of the street, and I will say, “Noted Philly’s fan, Alex Bazeley, he didn’t believe. He didn’t believe.”
ALEX: If it happens, I will give you back the $1,000 you gave me for— for the Jazz prediction.
BOBBY: Sounds like a wash.
ALEX: Okay.
BOBBY: Okay. NLDS number two, the San Diego Padres, A.J. Peller being vindicated versus the Los Angeles Dodgers. First time I’m saying that word here on this podcast—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —as we head into October. Feels like they’re always there. Oh, wait, because they are. It’s just like going on a decade—
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: —of this shit.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: I think if the Dodgers win the World Series this year, the narrative will be that Moneyball is fucking dead. RIP Moneyball.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: 2001 to 2024. You can’t do it anymore. You. They’ve beaten back the efforts of Moneyball at every turn. Who did they foil in the 2020 World Series, the Mickey Mouse World Series, Alex? Who did they foil?
ALEX: That would be the Tampa Bay Rays.
BOBBY: Exactly, right. And if they win again this year, who will come out of the other side of the bracket? Well, according to you, the Cleveland Guardians. And they’ll foil them, too. Stop with this little— small budget shit. Come over here. We’re driving Ferraris. We’re living in the hills. We got three MVPs.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: We got baseball’s most famous, best player ever.
ALEX: Yeah. Those MVPs might go back-to-back-to-back even.
BOBBY: God. What a glorious thing.
ALEX: What a—
BOBBY: LeBron sitting in the stands.
ALEX: Hmm.
BOBBY: Oh, my God.
ALEX: See, that— now that’s compelling. That is a compelling image.
BOBBY: I think if the Dodgers win the World Series this year, there’s going to be a lot of sort of— Andrew Friedman finally crowning him as one of the greatest champs ever. And like I said, Money— Moneyball, you just can’t compete with this when there’s a team that is doing all of the smart shit and also doing all of the obvious shit. They’re doing both. They’re winning on the margins and they’re winning the obvious ways. It’s basically the narrative that I’ve been trying to solidify on this podcast for the last four years about the Dodgers, and they just fucking fumble it every year.
ALEX: I know, I know.
BOBBY: They just fumble it every year, but by the way, sub-narrative, Ohtani is just the greatest to ever do it.
ALEX: Yes.
BOBBY: Like— and by the way, he’s gonna pitch next year.
ALEX: Right. Well, we’ll be getting a lot of like—
BOBBY: First year of Ohtani with the Dodgers, like—
ALEX: Right. Ohtani—
BOBBY: —contract the Angels.
ALEX: —like— yes, contract the Angels.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Gets his playoff due. National stage, international stage. Juicy. That’s enticing.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: I won’t lie.
BOBBY: Don’t forget when I read the lyrics of Vindicated on the pod, though.
ALEX: I would never, which is why—
BOBBY: Oh.
ALEX: —Padres prevail. I— I’m—
BOBBY: Damn.
ALEX: I— you know, I’ve been to sucker for the Padres the last few years, you know?
BOBBY: Slaying the giant up the I-5.
ALEX: Exactly. I— the— the way they’ve— they’ve built that team, you know, it’s like— it’s like—
BOBBY: God. It would be so annoying when they’re gonna be like, “Oh, it’s a good move to trade away Sotto.” I don’t know.
ALEX: Yeah. I know, I know, I know. Like we’re gonna— we’re gonna get some— some cultural backlash out of that— that Padres win.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: But at the very least—
BOBBY: Jurickson Profar ring, finally. We’ve been waiting.
ALEX: The once in future king.
BOBBY: We’ve been fucking waiting, dude. The Rangers and then Jurickson Profar getting rings in back-to-back years. Holy shit.
ALEX: Oh, my God.
BOBBY: It’s 2016. Oh, my God.
ALEX: Yeah. Sorry, I’m taking the Padres. The— the Preller Siedler — the Preller Seidler narrative, too strong for me.
BOBBY: That guy who I saw when I went to my first Padres game at Petco Park, who was wearing an A.J. Preller jersey is gonna be through the moon, over the moon, through the roof.
ALEX: He’s gonna—
BOBBY: He’s gonna be through the moon also, though. He might be dead as a doornail if he doesn’t take it easy. All right. NLCS.
ALEX: Okay.
BOBBY: Phillies— Phillies-Padres.
ALEX: The Phillies narrative is, once again, don’t overthink shit. Just— just—
BOBBY: Admit the Philadelphia is the center of the universe.
ALEX: Right. And— and Philly supremacy.
BOBBY: Yeah. A lot of bands that you like will be very happy. Think about the music that could come out of this.
ALEX: No, you’re telling me music comes out of joy?
BOBBY: So true. Oh, wow. Okay. Do you want to go back and say that the Mets eliminate the Phillies, then?
ALEX: Ooh, right. No, because I think—
BOBBY: Well, here’s— here’s the best possible option, Phillies eliminate the Mets— no, you don’t like— never mind. Damn. No, this doesn’t work.
ALEX: All right. It worked for a second there.
BOBBY: Because I— well, I— I thought for a second, I was going to be like, “Oh, all of our Long Island bros are going to be really upset, and they’re going to write good music.” But then I thought about the fact that [58:42] is a Yankees fan, but we already bounced them.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: So we’re gonna get good music out of that either way. So let’s just move on.
ALEX: Phillies-Padres, narrative ball champion.
BOBBY: Remind you— I need to remind you, on the other side of the bracket, you have the Cleveland Guardians waiting for them.
ALEX: The Cleveland Guardians. The vaunted Cleveland Guardians, who no one saw coming. And frankly—
BOBBY: Right.
ALEX: —that’s— that was a mistake. That’s how they sneak up on you.
BOBBY: First to your manager, right?
ALEX: Steven Vote.
BOBBY: Correct. That’s one of your guys.
ALEX: Oh. Ooh.
BOBBY: But don’t— don’t put the cart before the horse.
ALEX: I— I might root for the— all right, all right [59:18] all right.
BOBBY: So we need to finish the NLCS.
ALEX: Look, it’s just narratives, so I don’t want—
BOBBY: I think it would be nice if the cart did pull the horse sometimes. The horses are always having to work so hard. That’s so true, yeah.
BOBBY: I got that phrase right, by the way.
ALEX: That was— you did very well. Yes.
BOBBY: Thanks.
ALEX: I— I don’t want this to be an indictment on my fandom of the Philadelphia Phillies. You know, the team—
BOBBY: Is real.
ALEX: —the team that I am a very real fan of.
BOBBY: A couple more words for that would be authentic, genuine.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. Honest, heartfelt.
BOBBY: Passionate.
ALEX: Lived.
BOBBY: Experienced. We’re getting further away.
ALEX: All right. Unfortunately—
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: —the Padres narrative, too strong for me.
BOBBY: You love a GM.
ALEX: I love a GM. I really do. I love a savvy move. Fuck your pouring buckets of money, dump trucks of money.
BOBBY: Preller winning the World Series would be an awesome opportunity for us to dunk on Jerry Dipoto.
ALEX: That’s also true.
BOBBY: He’s the guy who makes all the trades, who actually puts together good teams? You mean? Like we got A.J. Preller at home. We finished one game out of the Wild Card every single year, we’re hanging the banner.
ALEX: Hey, man, we won 54% of our games this year.
BOBBY: They actually did.
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: Oh, man, I feel bad for the Mariners fans.
ALEX: Yeah, I do, too.
BOBBY: Such a great start to the year. I was— I was going through it. I was fretting. I was uncomfortable when Jarred Kelenic came up against Edwin Diaz in—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —game one, and he hit a single to keep that rally going. It’s like we’re really—
ALEX: Not the kind of narrative you want.
BOBBY: —we’re really doing the Edwin Diaz trade in real time—
ALEX: I know. Yeah, yeah.
BOBBY: —right now. And then— and— and then in the bottom of the ninth, Travis d’Arnaud comes up, famous former Met— famous Met killer in his post-Mets playing career.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: And what happens? He grounds out to Francisco Lindor, the guy who we’ve suffered for.
ALEX: Yep.
BOBBY: Man, good stuff shifting.
ALEX: All crazy narratives there. Too bad we left them in the first round of the playoffs.
BOBBY: Padres advance, Padres-Guardians. I’ll remind the listeners at home. Jose Ramirez, he’s pretty good.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: That’s the narrative [1:01:30] the Guardians win the World Series.
ALEX: That’s— that is— that is kind of the narrative.
BOBBY: Moreover, just like we should have been appreciating him as much as anyone else all along. And that Cleveland is as smart and as savvy as any other franchise, as any other front office in baseball versus A.J. Peller was right all along. Prospects ain’t shit. Get good players.
ALEX: Yeah, trust the process, man. Well, not even trust the process. Trust— trust A.J.
BOBBY: Deal with the fallout. Keep pushing those clothes back in your closet.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: So that your mom will let you go outside and play with your friends.
ALEX: Yep, exactly.
BOBBY: Padres-Guardians, who wins the Tipping Pitches Official 2024 Narrative Playoff Preview? According to Alex Bazeley.
ALEX: All right. Here it is. Are you ready for it?
BOBBY: I’m ready for it. I know a song with those words in it. Anything come to mind?
ALEX: No. It’s too— it’s late for— for a Taylor [1:02:26]
BOBBY: Can that song be on the soundboard that we buy in this offseason?
ALEX: Yes. Yeah.
BOBBY: Okay.
ALEX: You know, I was realizing, I— just to sidetrack a little bit. I do have a little, like, keyboard, like a MIDI keyboard that you plug in your computer, that we could reprogram.
BOBBY: New least surprising thing that’s ever been said on the podcast just dropped. Alex owns a MIDI keyboard.
ALEX: The 2024 Narrative-Ball—
BOBBY: World Series Champion.
ALEX: —World Series Champion, ground ball to third base. Machado picks it up, throws it over to Solano. They have done it.
BOBBY: Oh!
ALEX: A.J. Preller, vindicated. The San Diego Padres have won the 2024—
BOBBY: Play my music.
ALEX: —World Series.
BOBBY: Wow. You’re such a— you’re such a— you’re such a management show. I love it. I love it.
ALEX: Yeah, yeah.
BOBBY: I love it. To win one for Peter.
ALEX: Uh-hmm. That’s right.
BOBBY: Win one for A.J.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: All right. Good choice. I like it.
ALEX: Okay.
BOBBY: Do you think this was a good way of previewing the playoffs?
ALEX: If—
BOBBY: Do you think people who are listening to this are like, “Thank God, I already listened to Effectively Wild, because I actually know what’s gonna go on in the playoffs.”?
ALEX: I think it was a way of previewing the playoffs, yeah.
BOBBY: Cool. It’s as— honestly, as valid and predictive as us trying to think about, like, how does this pitching match up with this lineup?
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: That’s nonsense.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: That’s nonsense.
ALEX: Bobby—
BOBBY: Alex.
ALEX: —you did a lot of work pulling together these narratives.
BOBBY: Thank you. This is how— this is just what I think about, though.
ALEX: I know it is.
BOBBY: This is like— this is— there’s nothing new here.
ALEX: But— but I appreciate it.
BOBBY: If I wasn’t doing this, I would be doing this.
ALEX: Yes, I—
BOBBY: You know?
ALEX: Yeah. Well, that’s why we started a pod— we were doing all this all our whole lives.
BOBBY: Yeah. It’s all back to square one.
ALEX: This was fun. Thank you for putting it together.
BOBBY: Congrats to the Padres. Congrats to Padres fans.
ALEX: Yep.
BOBBY: Congrats A— congrats to A.J. Preller, and congrats, post-mortem, to Peter Seidler.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: And you know what? Let’s say, even throw up further back, Joan Kroc.
ALEX: Joan Krock, Krocks, yeah.
BOBBY: You knew exactly what I was—
ALEX: I knew exactly what you were going for.
BOBBY: This is why we do this podcast. Oh, it’s so great. Do you want to talk about the A’s, or do you want to push this responsibility into the offseason, or to the Patreon feed?
ALEX: I feel like we did a lot of A’s on the Patreon last week.
BOBBY: Yeah, we did.
ALEX: Let’s do it. Let’s talk about it. I’m actually— I’m already regretting, like—
BOBBY: Look at you, it’s like— it’s like I— it’s like I told you to do your homework, like, a night early, and you’re like, “But do I have to?”
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: “You know, it’s like not due technically.”
ALEX: I know.
BOBBY: You have the whole offseason before they have to play a game in Sacramento.
ALEX: Well, yeah, but I mean— I mean, this weird spot right now of, like, I— like, I find it really hard for me to foresee me following them.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: I mean, like, look, I watch baseball sometimes.
BOBBY: Shocking.
ALEX: Some— every once in a while.
BOBBY: People listening at home are like, “Didn’t I just—”
ALEX: Like, “What?”
BOBBY: “—listen to you guys not talk about baseball for the last hour and 20 minutes?”
ALEX: So, like, I am gonna watch the A’s, but like, it’s— they’re not the Oakland A’s anymore.
BOBBY: No, they’re not.
ALEX: Why? They’re not my hometown team. They’re not the team I grew up watching.
BOBBY: They’re a different team entirely now.
ALEX: They are a different team entirely. They’re playing in a different stadium. I— Lord knows what their jerseys are going to look like. I— you know, I— they have talked about how we hope fan— you know, you still come out and see the green and gold. I— so they’re gonna keep the colors, sure. Like, again, like, I— there’s so many unanswered questions and there’s a part of A’s Twitter that’s, like, sitting here being like, “Um, I’m still holding my breath for, like, some, you know, 11th hour miracle.” You know? Like, I have no—
BOBBY: I mean, there are— there are paths [1:05:55] there. I know that we’ve done this a million, frankly, more times, but I was listening to my co-worker Logan Murdock on The Bill Simmons Podcast talking about baseball, and he was like, “One phone call to Joe Lacob and the A’s probably stay in Oakland.” And I think that’s probably still true, even though that has always been the pipe dream that has never even felt realistic. I think mostly because of the John Fisher side.
ALEX: Yeah. Well, I think that Fisher and—
BOBBY: I think Joe Lacob is just the stand-in for literally anybody who wants to get into sports ownership, who would rather be in the Bay Area than fucking Las Vegas.
ALEX: Right. Exactly. I think it all funnels down on the ownership side and the league, and Manfred, right? Who, at this point, I think, probably wants to save face and see this out more than he does really want to keep baseball in Oakland. I think he’d rather be done with this, rather than drag out—
BOBBY: Three years in a Minor League park.
ALEX: —three years in a minor league park to, what, then come back to Oakland if Joe Lacob buys the team? Like I’m— I don’t know. We’re getting very in the weeds here.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: I’m—
BOBBY: No, but I think you’re hitting on something important, though, which is that it actually legitimately feels like it’s more about saving face than really about doing anything that makes sense for anyone now.
ALEX: Oh, yeah.
BOBBY: Like, they just— they committed to it because they were saying things with their chest in a bluff and now, they have to see it out, and I have to play the hands at the end.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: And this is just the longest game of poker that we’ve ever had to witness.
ALEX: Exactly.
BOBBY: And it’s— we see everyone’s cards, and we know what’s happening here. And yet, and yet, the dealer is still dealing the cards.
ALEX: Right.
BOBBY: You know?
ALEX: Yeah. Yeah.
BOBBY: But set— I mean, set that aside for a minute. You’re watching the final game.
ALEX: This Thursday was tough.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Really tough day.
BOBBY: I think—
ALEX: Like, if you saw me tweeting through it at all.
BOBBY: Unnaturally collective experience—
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: —in the baseball world for a regular season game. I mean, I wasn’t really following baseball as academically or as closely when the last team moved, when the Expos moved to Washington. But we didn’t have this kind of collective avenue to experience these things together that we have social media now and just the way that we watch baseball games is entirely different. And the way that we discuss them is entirely different. We have podcasts like this one. We have fan communities in different ways. I think everybody was just so sad, and then, of course, it’s an entirely different experience for you. But, like, I was getting choked up throughout the whole— the whole game.
ALEX: Yeah, I know.
BOBBY: Like, for me to shed a tear while Dallas Braden is talking, it takes something—
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: —supernatural, honestly.
ALEX: Yeah, it— it was— I mean, there was certainly something, like, heartening to see the entire— basically the entire baseball community come together and be like, “This is so wrong, what is being done here, that you were ripping this team away from these fans.” I mean, that was the kind of universal— that was the prevailing sentiment that I saw across my social media feed, in news outlets, wherever, basically everywhere, except for the A’s Twitter page. But it was hard. I think— I think, like, many A— I think that my experience probably mirrored many A’s fans, which is like, “I’ll believe it when I see it.”
BOBBY: Hmm.
ALEX: And then there it was. There was the last day at the Coliseum, right there in front of us.
BOBBY: Uh-hmm.
ALEX: And then it was over.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: And then the game ended, and they won. And it was a lovely game. I— like, I didn’t even really follow that— I was— I was like— that game happened in the middle of the day, as we talked about, and so I was like— I— I left work during, like, the fifth inning, because I was like, “I guess I’ll miss the couple middle innings. I’ll make it home in time for the— the— the last couple innings, then I’ll— I’ll just get to watch that and soak it all in.” And then I was stuck on the subway for, like, 20 minutes with, like, no service. So I was like, “I’m getting off at this stop,” and I’m sitting, trying to watch it on my phone.
BOBBY: Oh, man.
ALEX: Like, “I guess I’ll call an Uber, because these trains aren’t moving.” Thanks, Kathy Hochul.” And— and I was like— and the amount of rage that was boiling in my body that usually would probably be directed towards the M— MTA, that was all just like, “This is John Fisher’s fault. This is John Fisher’s fucking fault. This is— if I ever see that man in the fucking streets again wearing steel-toed boots.”
BOBBY: You had your chance, bro. You had your chance.
ALEX: Like, I know I had my— my chance and I— and I regret that, but I just— I felt—
BOBBY: You ever think about that? You could have been a hero. I’m not gonna elaborate.
ALEX: No, you’re not gonna elaborate. But I— yeah, things could have gone very differently. And I think I needed to get that rage out of my system, because when I got there and sat down in front of the TV, it was just like— it all—
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: —it all poured out. I— I mean, you can talk to my partner who saw me like— like, I had warned her ahead of time. I was like, “I’m gonna be a bit of a wreck, just so you know.” And she’s like, “Okay, sounds good.” I don’t think I prepared her enough.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Not nearly enough.
BOBBY: I mean, what could prepare you for that?
ALEX: Yeah. It was grief.
BOBBY: This— this—
ALEX: It was like grieving. You’re grieving the loss, not necessarily of a— of a person, but, like, of a feeling, of a community, of—
BOBBY: Of a shared history.
ALEX: — of, like, memories.
BOBBY: Yes.
ALEX: Yeah.
BOBBY: Exactly. It’s— for every reason that we talked about the Mets win at the beginning of this podcast, sending me into delirium, just making you believe that things will happen that shouldn’t happen for all of the investment, the time, the energy, the social contract of fandom, these things that feel so corny, that feel so ridiculous, for people who are as cynical as us, for people who, like, don’t really believe in things, like don’t believe in systems, don’t believe in blindly supporting things that aren’t actually doing good in the world. We just, like— we put that somewhere else, you know? We stuff that under the bed while we root for baseball teams. And why? Because we get to have that shared memory, like we get to have that shared experience. We get to suspend disbelief. Like, there are so few things in our lives where we have the comfort and the freedom to suspend our disbelief and just enjoy them. And baseball is one of those things for you and I, for a lot of people listen to this podcast, for millions of people throughout the country, throughout the world. And— and millions of people in the Bay Area. And by the way, they slammed the door shut. A’s fans slammed the door shut as we always knew they would, as we always knew they could, as we always knew was a total lie. They slammed the door shut on the narrative that the— the reason that they needed to leave was because the fans wouldn’t show out. Guess what? They showed out. And it wasn’t just that they showed out for the 2024 team, and it wasn’t that they showed out, and they were like, “Oh, this is some trendy team to be a fan of,” and, “Oh, we’re gonna sell— we’re gonna sell this hope and dream of a new, beautiful stadium.” No, they showed up for the Coliseum.
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: They showed up for the history, they showed up for Rickey, they showed up for Vida, they showed up for all of the A’s. They showed up for the Bash Brothers. They showed up for the Moneyball teams. They showed up because, like, there is a value there that has nothing— that is not pegged to money. It’s not pegged to the fluctuations of the Gap stock. It’s not pegged to market value. It’s not pegged to revenue streaming. It’s pegged to something that is better than those things. And yet, there’s no— there’s no agency there for us to do anything about that. And I think that baseball— as people listening to this show, know we feel this way, baseball is in a bad place because of that. Baseball is in a good place in so many other ways, but it’s impossible to ignore that, to me, this is, like, the biggest statement about what matters to baseball in this moment in the 2020s, what happened with the A’s. This is what matters to them. Never mind marketing Ohtani. Never mind they’re tweeting too much about Ohtani. Never mind the pitch clock. Never mind all this other stuff. This is like— what is all of that stuff for if you can’t be certain that a fan base that loves their team doesn’t get to keep their team? And I think that it— it— it felt like it all culminated in that moment, but it also weirdly felt sweet and beautiful and, like, happy and joyous at the same time. And the players were a big part of that. The fans were obviously a huge part of that. Mark Kotsay and his speech after the game—
ALEX: Uh-hmm.
BOBBY: —was a huge part of that. It felt like a brief moment where everybody was on the same page, then we were like, “Let’s leave John Fisher out of this moment for just a couple innings.” And that was nice. And I— I was happy to be able to watch that and experience that alongside you and all of the other A’s fans. But, of course, it’s a bummer. It’s a bummer way to end this episode. It’s a bummer way to end the season, but it’s— that’s reality. You know? That’s really what’s happening. It— like you said, believe it when you see it. Now, we’re being forced to see it.
ALEX: Yeah. Well, and, you know, credit where it’s due. I— I appreciate John Fisher coming out at the end of the game and— and thanking the fans and really giving a heartfelt speech, and sort of talking about how much he’s going to miss this place, and—
BOBBY: Shedding more light on the context.
ALEX: More— more light on the context, and really talking about why this is— why this is happening. Why—
BOBBY: Transparency accountability, honestly.
ALEX: Exactly.
BOBBY: Yeah.
ALEX: Oh, wait.
BOBBY: Womp, womp. Can we get the womp, womp sign on the MIDI keyboard?
ALEX: You know what? I’m fine, because that day was not for him, that—
BOBBY: No.
ALEX: He’s— he’s not an A’s fan. He’s not a representative of the Oakland A’s and— and what that means. Guess what? He’s going to be a fucking footnote in the history of Major League Baseball beyond you were the guy who stole the team away from Oakland.
BOBBY: Yep.
ALEX: Sorry, that is what it is.
BOBBY: It’s going to be in the first line of your obituary.
ALEX: That’s right. That’s— put it on your gravestone, man. Stole the team. Here we are.
BOBBY: All right. Well, it’s incumbent upon us to talk about this stuff. This is what we have this podcast for. This is why we’re here, to let out the real feelings, to talk about shit the way that we see it. And I know that it’s a bummer heading into the postseason, but hopefully, we can spend this October— I mean— I mean, hopefully our new team brings it home. The San Diego Padres.
ALEX: San Diego Padres.
BOBBY: Fourth team— Mr. President of fourth team—
ALEX: [1:16:09]
BOBBY: —Alex’s fandom. We’re so back.
ALEX: I’m trying to get one for each—
BOBBY: Like, time zone.
ALEX: Right, right.
BOBBY: Like corner of the US.
ALEX: Yeah, yeah. I need a Midwest— ooh, I need a Midwest team.
BOBBY: You had so many chances. I— like, I walked you right up to it, you know? I threw you the lob and you were just—
ALEX: And the Guardians were right there. I don’t know what to say.
BOBBY: Just came up short again, you know. Alex just— he just won’t visit Wisconsin. You won’t do it. Not when it’s the most important days of the campaign. Okay. Thank you everybody for listening. If you liked what you heard, please consider supporting us, patreon.com/tippingpitches. If you didn’t like what you heard, email us a feedback, but be nice about it, tipping pitchespod@gmail.com, 785-422-5881. If you’d like to call in about the narratives, if you’d like to submit alternative narratives about why you want your team to win the World Series. If they’re really good, we’ll share them on the podcast. Sort of unclear how the next few episodes will go, just because we have to see how the postseason schedule shakes out, but we’ll try to be as reasonable as we possibly can be, while also knowing that, you know, we tend to not really talk about the games that often here on this podcast. Any other parting thoughts as we walk out the door to dinner? I think people could probably tell that this was like a I had another coffee, empty stomach kind of episode.
ALEX: Right. Yeah. Do it for Pete. Seidler, to be very clear.
BOBBY: Oh, my God. Thanks, everybody, for listening. We’ll be back next week, I think, I hope.
ALEX RODRIGUEZ: Hello, everybody. I’m Alex Rodriguez. Tipping Pitches. Tipping Pitches. This is the one that I love the most. Tipping Pitches. So, we’ll see you next week. See ya!
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